Pirate mode: Harassment vs "Red is Dead" issue

[Rademenes]

attacking lower level tech player (especially vega by draconis) is like taking a child a lollipop

pg pvp system has some influence on players behaviour:

1) high level players don't want to fight with the same technology like other pilots because:

a) some of them don't have a proper ship (draconis ships are to expensive and most players are selling former ships, but if they get atlast their ideal ship it wil be nice if they spend some cryo to buy lower tech ships for more fair pvp)

b) some of them are saving cryo for their ideal ship and afraid to loose it in duel with lower level tech player or another higher level tech player who thinks 'RED is DEAD' (so losing cryo in duels should be count not on player level but on tech level - u r using lower tech, u loose lower amount of cryo on pvp)

2) low level players don't fight each other because they afraid that if they turn on pm any bigger fish will strike into their back because 'RED is DEAD' so:

a) we have very small amount of duels on normal planets (or maybe i didn't noticed more fights especially between high level tech players because if i saw duels i saw only between players that using lower tech ships or 'duels' like 'RED is DEAD')

my propositions:

1) it will be nice if we will can turn off pm mode by themselfs (i don't like messages: 'please somebody pod me because i wan't turn off pm mode'): if somebody will fight with friend using vega ships and they will notice a pirate with much better technology they could turn off their pm and don't give this 'brave' pirate oportunity to kill them easily - u want to fight wit us, choose the same tech ship or get lost

2) leave pm mode without changing (or make it permanent), add only new achievements like: s..t pirate, coward pirate or scum pirate for players that will kill many lower tech players - if this pirate some day will say u that he is very 'skilled' and 'brave' u will look into his achievements and will know the truth about him

3) pvp block list - u can add some players to your list that poded u with higher tech ship, next time they will not have posibility to pod u when u r in pm mode (this list is disabled on CQ planets)

4) permanent pm mode (after level 10) and:

a) players from clans can attack any level tech player from other clans and only the same level tech player from outside clans

b) players ouside clans can attack only players with the same tech from clans or outside clans

so u will can choose to play more challenging (b) or 'RED is DEAD' (a) pvp mode by choosing to be part of team or a lone wolf

 

[ON_ur_SYX]

You can not own a harvester field. If you don't want to share go somewhere else!

I've shared a field with someone while both of us were in PM even, (just ask RazorBladeKiss). What I do mind however, is when someone just comes barreling in a field and starts shooting everything without regard to the player that was already there. Sure, we don't own any particular field, no one can, but it is common courtesy to ask " do you mind if we share the area/field?" If this were done then a lot of the problem with complaining would end.

I also just want to point out that wasn't there a rule that stated that if someone came into the field that someone else was in, they had to leave if the person asked them to leave the area nicely? I seem to remember a rule that said this person had to leave if politely requested to? do so? But like I said above... I really don't mind sharing... I have shared many grinding areas with ally and adversary alike. Its the bully mentality of someone who just barges on the scene and rudely takes over a field that i find rude.

 

[pimpslapper]

The term "Red Is Dead" has been an unwritten rule in these types of games for a long time. I can remember when I first started playing this game and being in Vega getting squashed by higher lvl players all the time and it was just part of the game is the way I looked at it so rather than whining about it the way most do now I leveled up through the ranks and caught up with the higher lvl players and squashed them back. It is a kill or be killed type of game people not care bear playhouse game so lets all go back to playing the way it was when I started playing because it was a much more fun game to play when you had knock down drag out pod fest clan wars without all the crying because you got podded by a group of players. I know WRichards and syx remember those good days..... The pod fest clan wars was what made this game fun to play but I guess those good times are all gone now.

 

[HardWick]

I like the responses here. I didn't know so many shared the red=dead and "play the game, stop whining" mentality. If I had a heart, it would be warmed by such responses.... ^^

But seriously, after a few "talking to's" by some GM's about not podding players of other clans "just because they're red" and being sworn at, threatened, insulted, "ordered" to leave a harvy spot, constantly told by one admiral (who shall remain nameless) and his whole clan, that podding someone on a mission (when they're red) is in some way shape or form against the CoC, I just figured it was me who held on to the Red=Dead mentality....


I guess in seeing these responses, that the problem is not actually podding someone who's red but in the fact that some think they're entitled to be red and not at risk of being attacked. Most admirals are cool and tell their people "If you don't wanna get podded, stay out of PM." There are some people in some clans that I'd happily pod if I stumbled across them even if they were in a Phoenix and I was in a parsec, but that's restricted to a few "deserving" individuals and they mostly know who they are.....

Syx knows if I'm feeling frisky I'll pop some of her folks if I stumble upon them in PM. Ship classes don't matter much to me but I generally restrict such activity to R60 Sols and up. I also fully expect a target on my back and others to come looking for me later. Be it on a mission, or in a harvy field. It's all good, part of the game and I have a cryo vault running so the only thing it costs me is, well, it doesn't cost me anything, which is why I don't really care about being podded.
It's a game and honestly, the "defeated blah blah" and "killed by so-and-so" in my history are about as important to me in the grand scheme of things as the lint that collects over night in my belly button. The fact that others get so annoyed by being podded is a form of entertainment all its own and I just chuckle with how despondent and enraged they get.

I realize that makes me sound cruel, heartless and what-not, but common, they call it PIRATE galaxy for a reason mate.

 

[CapnSanta]

Personally, I think the only important thing in the game is GREENS! All this chitter chatter about don't do this in that tech and don't do that in this tech in this or that system is getting SO LAME!

How hard is it for you lot to realise that going red INVITES attack.. the game EVEN WARNS YOU ABOUT IT!

So quit yer JIBBER JABBER and play... it really has only become a "real" issue since SS have made the achievement system include PM for SMs and WMs. But going PM is a risk you take.. plain and simple.

PLEASE don't STUFF UP THE GAME even MORE with more and more restrictions of what the hell you can use and where! Its getting a bit too much! Why get better tech if only to have its use RESTRICTED?? So stupid a mentality really.

Maybe we ought to ask to have the name of the game changed to RESTRICTED GALAXY?

 

[Rademenes]

i have only one question, is this proposition is bad?:

4) permanent pm mode (after level 10) and:

a) players from clans can attack any level tech player from other clans and only the same level tech player from outside clans (RED is DEAD = Clan Wars)

b) players ouside clans can attack only players with the same tech from clans or outside clans (for people that prefer to fight more fair eg. u r doing mission as a red and the same level tech player only can attack u so u have the chance defend yourself and finish your mission, if he killed u ok, it was good fight!!!)

so u will can choose to play more challenging (b) or 'RED is DEAD' (a) pvp mode by choosing to be part of team or a lone wolf

if u prefer fighting like RED is DEAD u will make your own clan or join to somebody's clan
if u like to fight fair and have more pleasure form pvp mode u will not join to any clan

EVERYBODY IS HAPPY (yep only in my opinion so far)

i don't want to change pvp mode in PG (if players don't agree with my proposition, ok, no problem, i don't treat pvp mode in games like religious fanatic), but i'm only asking what u r thinking about it, if it is good proposition maybe one day i will sell my idea to other game companies, if not i will try to invent something else

 

[Defcon]

I say, Podding lower level tech adds nothing to the game.

So go on, restrict PM option to tech level. There will be a lot more people in PM when u are not at risk getting podded by some idiot in a 2 systems higher ship.

You restrict the missions to tech level, so balance this thing out and prevent people in low tech getting shot by high tech.

Simple.

Still red = dead, still pirate galaxy, but on fair level. Make the Pm just in different colors. Or put a little mark behind name if someone is in Vega tech. That way u see exactly who u may attack or who might be a threath.

Defcon

 

[Rademenes]

I say, Podding lower level tech adds nothing to the game.

So go on, restrict PM option to tech level. There will be a lot more people in PM when u are not at risk getting podded by some idiot in a 2 systems higher ship.

You restrict the missions to tech level, so balance this thing out and prevent people in low tech getting shot by high tech.

Simple.

Still red = dead, still pirate galaxy, but on fair level. Make the Pm just in different colors. Or put a little mark behind name if someone is in Vega tech. That way u see exactly who u may attack or who might be a threath.

Defcon

yes it is simple, but some players want only 'RED is DEAD' but in 'draconis vs. vega' manner, so in my proposition i wanted try to make happy all and give my proposition more chances to be implemented in games (companies don't loose players who wanted to kill lower level players and gain player that want to play in more fair way)

we can implement more pm modes in games:
a) red - if player choose to be red he can fight with everybody (RED is DEAD, u will get more cryo and xp by using this mode, more risk more bonuses)
b) yellow - if player choose to be yellow he can fight only with player with the same level (YELLOW is DEAD u will get less cryo and xp like in (a) mode, but more than in (c) mode)
c) green - if player wants only to do missions and play pve (GREEN is ALIVE, no bonus for cryo and xp, no risk no bonuses)

btw. it hard to implement good pvp mode in games, especialy sci-fi (in rpg we have more stuff like scrolls, potions, long/composite bows etc. to try to lower level distance between players, we have trees, barrels and other enviroment stuff to hide behind and try to escape from rival)

in sci-fi movies if u have lower ship u can always try to escape from bigger enemy: u can transfer energy from guns and torpedos to shields system and later use warp and jump drive to escape, in game not only PG (it is hard to implement all stuff from sci-fi movies ;( )if u met bigger enemy - one shot and game over

 

[Adrana]

Rademenes, you are a Kalgan pilot as it says at your profile, do you realize that Askone vs Kalgan is a totally different server what comes to the amount of players playing it.
If you would have perm pm on, there is no way to be able to do the even now hard sm's on Askone.
You can fly hours around on Kalgan and you don't meet anyone on several planets, but that is not the way it is on Askone, Korell or even Solaria.

To take advantage of your idea, first please make an account on Askone, do your sm's with pm on, and continue forwards Draconis, then after that think of your idea again, and reflect if you still want to go forward with your ideas.

Askone = Crowded
Kalgan = Mostly deserted

When you do ideas, do it thinking of all servers and how it affects on crowded and less crowded servers.
Kalgan is sometimes as I call it, a deserted island.

 

[Rademenes]

Rademenes, you are a Kalgan pilot as it says at your profile, do you realize that Askone vs Kalgan is a totally different server what comes to the amount of players playing it.
If you would have perm pm on, there is no way to be able to do the even now hard sm's on Askone.
You can fly hours around on Kalgan and you don't meet anyone on several planets, but that is not the way it is on Askone, Korell or even Solaria.

To take advantage of your idea, first please make an account on Askone, do your sm's with pm on, and continue forwards Draconis, then after that think of your idea again, and reflect if you still want to go forward with your ideas.

Askone = Crowded
Kalgan = Mostly deserted

When you do ideas, do it thinking of all servers and how it affects on crowded and less crowded servers.
Kalgan is sometimes as I call it, a deserted island.

i think that my idea last is good for all servers, the only one difference to present PG pm mode is YELLOW pm mode:

---------this is my last proposition but i think u answered me on my no 4 proposition----------
we can implement more pm modes in games, player can switch it everytime or they can be turned to green after one week or another period or when somebody is killed:

a) red - if player choose to be red he can fight with everybody who is (with any level ship, even with noobs if they like)RED and only the same level ship who is YELLOW (RED is DEAD, u will get more cryo and xp by using this mode, more risk [u can be Vega and be poded by Draco] more bonuses)
b) yellow - if player choose to be yellow he can fight only with player with the same level ship from RED and YELLOW pm modes (YELLOW is DEAD u will get less cryo and xp like in (a) mode, but more than in (c) mode, less risk to die [u can be poded only by player with the same tech ship so it easier to defend])
c) green - if player wants only to do missions and play pve (GREEN is ALIVE, no bonus for cryo and xp, no risk no bonuses, nobody can attack GREEN GREEN and vice-versa, GREEN can attack only mantises)
---------my last proposition----------
show me why we can't implement it on all servers?

 

[Adrana]

c) green - if player wants only to do missions and play pve (GREEN is ALIVE, no bonus for cryo and xp, no risk no bonuses, nobody can attack GREEN)

Not everyone who is playing this game enjoys the pvp's or Cq's, nor even turning the PM on, that should never be a must in this game. Me inclusively after 2 years I would abandon this game if such ideas would be implemented.

Why should any player doing hard missions be penalized with no bonus for cry and xp?
You are ripping off the whole concept of this game by this propose of yours.
How do you think a player as this will ever progress in this game if they don't get xp nor cry well deserved for the hard missions they do, just cause they want to play it safe?

I don't know what system player you are as you don't have your proper level in your profile, but have you yet been on Draconis? Do you have any idea of what it would be if those missions would not give any bonus of cry or xp if they want to play it safe, first of all pilots would never reach rank 70 for to be able to get the Draconis ship, 2nd, they would not have cry for to be able to even by a Gazica blaster to their ship, and here not talking about any rares what costs from was it 64k to ??? have no idea.

Some sm's are very hard and players doesn't want to risk of failing having the pm on.
Many pilots can have pm on, but what I have seen before doing a hard sm, they request someone to pod them to get the pm off before starting the sm.

There is no logic in removing anything just because a player want to be safe.

Ps. I just saw in your sig you are level 38, aka you must then be a Mizar player, maybe Mars.
Well you still have to experience SOL system, and when you reach Draconis, let us see your opinion of your idea then .

 

[Rademenes]

ok, my english isn't good, byt try to understand me, please, and try to read my proposition from angle of more fair pm mode (YELLOW) not that i'm hardcore pvp player:

c) green - if player wants only to do missions and play pve (GREEN is ALIVE, no bonus for cryo and xp, no risk no bonuses, nobody can attack GREEN)

Not everyone who is playing this game enjoys the pvp's or Cq's, nor even turning the PM on, that should never be a must in this game.

for this is GREEN mode and green mode can playc CQ to if the want, when they land on CQ planet they will turn into Yellow automatically (on CQ planets we fight with the same tech so it is YELLOW mode in my proposition), and nobody can attack GREEN and vice-versa (should be clear now)

Why should any player doing hard missions be penalized with no bonus for cry and xp?
You are ripping off the whole concept of this game by this propose of yours.
How do you think a player as this will ever progress in this game if they don't get xp nor cry well deserved for the hard missions they do, just cause they want to play it safe?

bonuses i mean - more cryo for killing mantises in RED, less cryo when u r YELLOW , and the lowest cryo when u r GREEN

do we have now any advantage when we killing mantises RED mode (here i mean present pm mode on) or not? if not forget about bonuses in my proposition

but if r GREEN u fight only against mantises, if u r in YELLOW or RED u will fight against mantises and other pirates which could try to kill u when u r doing missions, some players will try to play as Yellows or Reds without bonus because they like to have more exciting game mode, but some players will think that playing without any bonuses as Yellows or Reds it is waste of time because they will have the same cryo or xp when they will be GREEN, so bonus is not essencial if playesr can play without small bonus to xp or cryo as Yellows or REDs

as i said this proposition do not change anything exept new pm mode - YELLOW (that is really nothing more that rules from CQ planets - the same ship tech - transfered to everyday playing) and some changes to RED mode (here i mean pm mode turned on like in present system), u can still decide like now be or not to be in pm, but u have one more pm option more

so:

we have now:

1) pm mode turned on (RED)
2) pm mode turned off (WHITE)

in my proposition will be:

1) RED pm mode in my system is like pm mode turned on in present with one exeption -> u can read about it on previous page (Player name is RED)
2) YELLOW pm mode - the only new pm mode - the same rules like on CQ planets - i mean the same ship tech (Player name is YELLOW)
3) GREEN/WHITE pm mode in my system is similar to present system pm mode turned off (Player name is GREEN or WHITE like now)

i hope that is more clear now too

and last question to GMs and SS:

Do u think about changing PM mode in the future (not now) or not? If not please write it clearly and we will not discuss about it anymore. It could be locked topic on the forum with this answer. Me and other people that are thinking about more fair pm modes will hold our ideas in our drawers.

and sorry for my bad english

 

[ridoi]

I don't get so much of your idea, but I don't think modifying the key, pvp element for player vs player should be changed. don't think your idea was any good, if you ask me.

 

[Rademenes]

I don't get so much of your idea, but I don't think modifying the key, pvp element for player vs player should be changed. don't think your idea was any good, if you ask me.

we discuss here about poding low level players, i hope

if u r eg. from Vega and want to play in pm mode but without being killed by eg. Draco ship u will use YELLOW pm mode and will only risk to fight with the same level ship player, any ship above you will not kill you by one shot but u will enjoy fight as pirate with players that have the same ship (for me it is more fair and i think some players will prefer to use Yellow mode)

as i said RED and GREEN is the same like current pm modes (on or off), u can ask why i want leave RED if we will have YELLOW in my proposition, because for some players changing PM to something without 'RED is DEAD' (against lower level tech players) is like to 'be or not to be'

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
an example to my pm system:

so if u have Draconis ship and you choose:

- RED pm mode - u will can attack everone (even 'noobs') from RED pm mode (players names are red) and only players with Draco ship from YELLOW pm mode (players names r yellow)

- YELLOW pm mode - u will can attack only players with Draco ship from RED or YELLOW mode

- GREEN pm mode (players names r green) - u can not attack anybody and vice-versa - is like present pm mode turned off

and similar for others ships tech which u choose
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

ok, if this idea is to big problem to implement it in PG, fine

ok, i give up, i can not explain it more simple (my post on previous page - the last one, should be understandable with later explanations, if not it is my fault)

have a nice day/evening everybody

 

[BeN]

someone writed that erlier and that isnt aNEW IDEA ,, for me i think solution is simple..
pm on draconis ship can shoot only a draconis ship on pm
sol can shoot sol but cant shoot draco and lower system ships...

but the only problem with weapons...
for example a lvl 60 sniper with top gazica bps .. could be able to shoot a ,,red" thats in same ship but with only sol items ?

the problem with ppl shooting newbies is old like this game.. some ppl even know who just fly on vega with sol ship just to shoot down newbies that cant even have a shadow of chance to defend...

 

[Rademenes]

someone writed that erlier and that isnt aNEW IDEA ,, for me i think solution is simple..
pm on draconis ship can shoot only a draconis ship on pm
sol can shoot sol but cant shoot draco and lower system ships...

i agree with this solution

but the only problem with weapons...
for example a lvl 60 sniper with top gazica bps .. could be able to shoot a ,,red" thats in same ship but with only sol items ?

ok, I understand your concerns, but my Yellow mode is like mode on Collosus, so in my proposition player with Draco and RED can land on eg. Aurora but could anly attack all RED players and YELLOW players with Draco ship and Draco devices on board (if he try to attack GREEN player or YELLOW player with different tech he will get warning message that to do this he has to have proper shi and tech on board), rest will be safe and everybody can kill harvesters even if they have better ships (but ok it will need more changes in game mechanics, but could they make it in the future - next year, after 2 years, not now)

or they don't have to change pm mode but give us one planet in every system where we can do pvp like on eg. Collosus but everytime when we wish to do that and not waiting for another shedule when Collosus is oppened, so if somebody wants to login only to make pvps without being killed by bigger fish he could do that

the problem with ppl shooting newbies is old like this game..

not only in PG, and everywhere are the same discusions

some ppl even know who just fly on vega with sol ship just to shoot down newbies that cant even have a shadow of chance to defend...

but some players don't know who is bad pirate and who is fair (especialy new ones), we have gold skulls, so maybe we can implement BLACK SKULLS to indicate 'noob killer', so if u see on the orbit player with BLACK SKULL u will not use pm mode and don't give him easy bounty

but SS could write something like this in one locked and sticked thread (and live in peace):

We don not change our pm mode, because we know that there is no simple method to make it more fair without changing game mechanics (if we have to do this it will take us to much time, to much money etc.): (devs can write some examples like yours with weapons). But to make it more fair without changing anything our GM will try to prevent to kill 'newbies' in game or punish unfair players by: (GMs can write some examples).

and this thread should stop all discussions on forum and game chat about:

- why GMs banned me, i only killed stupid 'noob'

- why higher level tech player killed me, is he 'noob' which afraid fight with me using the same tech

after read that most players ('noobs', 'noobs' killers and 'noobs' defenders) should understand the situation and stop discuss about this topic

 

[blackroger]

I don't get so much of your idea, but I don't think modifying the key, pvp element for player vs player should be changed. don't think your idea was any good, if you ask me.

Agreed.....we have been down this road many times in the past, and I think it is safe to say that there are a huge number of pilots that DO NOT want more restrictions in this game. Surely the devs time would be better spent on creating a new system, or correcting the sniper's OS.

 

[BeN]

Sorry Rademenes but from all what i had read your becomes to much similar to a ,, diferent mmo in space " game
well one thing i really liked..
that when you have pm on you can earn more cryo and more xp ! this is good idea.. higher risk.. higher cryo..
that is ok.
but how i writed erlier.. and how i think solution should be simple.. becouse only simple solutions are the best
just shotly when i turn pm on.. im able to shoot only people in same system ships.

my problem is only about diference of tech on the same class of ship.

but problems like that i think can be easy solved by developers..


good discusion btw

 

[Defcon]

Well BeN,

That tech problem is allready solved. When u take a mission in mizar for example you cannot land on that planet with tech off soll.

It is similar. Of you click on a white player or an allie in PM, you cannot shoot him.

It can't be hard to programm it the same way. You click on lower tech pilot, you cannot attack.

To people who see this as a further 'restriction'.

It is strange that most pilots say they 'usually' don;t pod lower tech. And then suddenly see it as a 'restriction' to prevent low level podding by reprogramming it.

It is possible.
It will prevent people getting annoyed or set up getting shot bye a big ship they have no chance fighting at all.
It will prevent a lot of name calling in public chat.
It will save time of GM's dealing with people sending in screenshots of namecalling / harrassement.
It will keep people out off jail, who cannot resist podding lower level tech.
It will stop disencouragement off low level players getting podded.
It will encourage flying in PM, because u don;t risk getting podded by the one shot big ship. Many times you see little reds in orbit, not landing because of big reds on lz.

We will loose absolutely nothing, because it is pointless to shoot lower level to begin with.
Most people allready try to avoid it (they say at least) en agree that it is not very brave.

Don't talk about restrictions. Because shooting lower tech is allready 'restricted' at least we say it is.

Just program it in and let's move on.

Thank you

 

[BeN]

yeah defcom i thinked about same ,, that this system would be similar to this with ,,missions" and tech ..