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PG ship controls and steering issues

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tuusk

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To offset criticism following I must note that as programmer I am very much impressed that something like Pirate Galaxy is written in Java and how lightweight its client. However I would like to address to issues which in my opinion can severly hinder this game growing any more popular. In my biased opinion, fixing this is much more important then bells and whistles which latest patches seem to concentrate on.



NB! Following here is pretty long as it is not meant as easy reading but rather (hopefully) to give some feedback and ideas for game developer how and what to fix to allow PG to prosper.


---> TLDR ... ;)

Even with decades of gaming experience, I have still had great difficulties in adapting to Pirate Galaxy client controls and steering. I can just imagine just how hard it might be for inexperienced gamers. As it is, it seems barely playable. There lot of problems which create constant stress to me and as much I have asked, other players agree.

1) When you select ANY target, your ship instantly starts moving toward target, often turning your ship around and heading opposite direction you are going when all you want to do is to see/scan target or shoot it while running. This also happens when acquiring targets with TAB - which can create horrible graphical lag by flapping camera quickly toward many different directions. Un-checking "Enable Look-At-Target" in settings does not have any effect on that. I really see ABSOLUTELY NO NEED to start movement on target selection and when there is, you should be perfectly able to move ship yourself - or what hell is players function anyways ?

2) It is just recently when I discovered that you can target without starting movement by right-clicking objects. This works unlike any user interface I have used so far (out of hundreds) but it is still better then broken left-click targetting. However it conflicts with ability to steer camera with right-click as it seems to pick up targets now and then even while you firmly holding right button down. It also conflicts ability to click-to-move with right-click for very same reason. Using left-click for those tasks is simply TOO DANGEROUS as it starts movement when you accidentally click on object and turns ship!!!

3) I have had great difficulty of understanding why your ship movement has to be bound to camera direction - reverse would make more sense even when it should be optional. When you check "Disable ship chaser camera" and "Use relative ship controls" in settings, it still turns ship toward camera direction in many occasions, making controlling direction very awkward. It looks totally absurd to me that while using WASD to control ship, it always turns camera first and ship follows half second later, very often turning ship opposite to direction you pointed !?!

4) While using "relative controls", click-to-move is often more reliable way to choose your ships direction due broken WASD. However it usually stops your ship movement first and then starts moving at second or third click only. It also seems to start movement much more slowly then other ways of steering your ship and sometimes walls and corners can catch your ship and set it rotating for while - usually until podded. While your ship is in near high walls or in canyon, clicks often go to inside or atop of invisible walls which definitely should not happen.

5) When there lot of active ships (Mantis) around you, even while there does not seem to be noticeable graphical lag, controlling your ships becomes sluggish or impossible. It is like going through thick jelly. I suggests me that ship controls are not interpreted by client but sent to server for interpretation. This is wrong approach in my opinion as there three kinds of lag in effect, which can create huge differences between client and server viewpoints. In this case it is best to apply user controls based on WHAT IS VISIBLE to user and server should correct, taking closest possible approximation.

6) While clicking on enemies and objects, client very often loses target in next second or picks different target by some reason. My best guess is that it may happen because I am holding right mouse button to steer camera but I have no idea how to avoid that. Also, while shooting at something, when your mouse cursor passes over or even close to other ship (happens most often with Harvesters), it may give it shot or two or switch target to it. It can even happen when that other ship is not visible - possibly due its aura effects showing on your screen.

7) I can not count how many times I have been podded because repeatedly losing my target while using click-to-move, which is only somewhat reliable method of steering. This happens because BOTH mouse buttons try to do contradicting tasks at same time: selecting target and movement. Why could we not have just one (left) mouse button for selecting targets and other one for movement - PLEASE! Camera steering selection in setting should work fine - if it would only steer camera and not pick up random targets while you holding steering button.

8) This may look like minor issue but can still create huge problems for players: ... All ship types but Storm ( battleship ) have "3" for repair and "4" for afterburner which makes switching over to/from that type of ship very painful. Also, second most often used skill key "2" is very tricky to use while operating WASD controls. It would help great deal if collector was either changed or duplicated to something easier to access, like "C" and if you did not have to use on every piece of loot separately. It would be very nice if that could be either changed with option or better yet to make ship skill-bar fully configurable.

[END]
 

tuusk

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[ this post is not complete yet but feel free to offer improvements]

Below is also example how PG controls and steering should ideally work in my opinion.
I am not trying to invent wheel, this is close how most MMO-s interfaces work nowdays,
which should make new players transition to PG much easier.


Ideally it should be fully configurable but for now we can just start with bare minimum
of working interface. At very least you should be able to swap left and right click functions
in settings. I would not mind if changing settings would mean editing configuration files either
as long as it is one-time change and you did not have to re-do it after each update anyways.


As many MMO-s have realized lately, would be really smart to separate target and focus.
In PG case focus should be what you shoot at, while you use target to check for new victim
or heal squad member.



LEFT MOUSE BUTTON:
* click = just select target ( no turning toward target, no move or action )
* click-hold = steer camera ( configurable )
* double-click = default action on that kind of object ( attack/collect )

RIGHT MOUSE BUTTON:
* click = move toward location ( should never target anything and pathing optional )
* click-hold = move ship forward and steer camera ( reset camera on release )
* double-click = approach/follow ( not necessarily target it )

LEFT+RIGHT MOUSE BUTTONS:
* click = cancels any other movement/status and action in progress
* hold = move and steer ship+camera

MIDDLE MOUSE BUTTON or "R":
* click = turn auto-move on/off

<W> <A> <S> <D> and arrows ( for lefty-s or people with two right hands ):
* hold = move/turn ship to appropriate direction
* double-tap = lock movement to direction
* tap = release direction lock

<Q> and <E>, <Del> and <End>:
* hold = strafe left/right
* double-tap = lock strafe to direction
* tap = release direction lock

4th MOUSE BUTTON or <X>:
* click = start/stop auto-fire on target ( and possibly set it as focus )

5th MOUSE BUTTON or <C>:
* click = start collector device operation
( ideally should auto-collect everything in collector range )

<TAB>:
* click = select next target
( if no previous target, choose closest target in front of your ship )

<shift-TAB>
* click = select previous target

<ctrl-TAB>
* click = select next closest friendly target
( if no previous target - choose closest friendly target, including AM bombs and like )

<SPACE>:
*click = use/scan/activate target

<ctrl-1/2/3/4/5>:
*click = use specified gravitron

<Z>:
*click: Open mission panel

<V>:
*click: Open map panel


Beauty of this setup is that you can do most of important actions with either mouse or keyboard,
left or right hand alone. That allows you handle coffee cup or sandwitch without risk of getting podded.
 

Razzorkill

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Two things that might make it easier to steer:
1 use relative ship control.
2 disable ship chaser camera.
This way it's much easier to control the ship :)
 

Ages

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Control has been a major problem since I started about a month ago. I just built my top tech r60 ship for sol, and still get frustrated when my ship and I have different ideas of where It should be moving or doing. I feel that improvements to ship control would be the best way to improve overall game experience in Pirate Galaxy.

I personally would like to see the addition of an "auto-move" function. It would produce continuous forward thrust, allowing you to move without having to hold a key down. My preferred way this would work if everything else remains the same, is that it would function just like holding down up arrow or "w" key, but would disengage as soon as "a,s,d or any of the arrow keys" where pushed. You simple toggle auto-move on and then steer with your mouse.

Alternately it could allow steering right and left without turning off or only disengage when you toggle auto-move back off, or use backwards movement.

There are a few options of how to do this, but please... save our fingers!

Also we NEED map-able key bindings!
(if done correctly, you could solve almost all of the complaints the author mentioned without changing the way movement works by default. The user would simply have the option to customize it, finding their own style of control)

For this to work we would need, at a minimum, separate map-able binds for:
"selecting targets" "movement" "select and move to" "select next closest and move to" "select move to location" and of course, "auto-move"

Scenario: I am grinding for experience on a harvester close to my rank.

-- I currently would try to click with my right mouse button on a mantis interceptor as a Death Squad is flying by. The interceptor beings to move and I end up clicking the ground instead, causing me to begin to move to that location. I move into range of the DS by accident, and get stunned. Armor reaches zero before I have ability to recover, and I pod.

++ With the ability to remap my "click and move to location" binding, I can set my right click to only "select" the mantis and not move if I happen to miss click, and I can use left click to move to a location if I want to. When the interceptor moves and I click on the ground by accident my ship stays in its current location, so I simply click the interceptors new location. The DS flies by out of stun range and I am able to reduce the mantis to cryonite before it can get many shots off.



if you create separate binds for "selecting mantis", "players" and "objects" (like E or cryo) that would be a huge plus.

Bind examples:
"select next closest mantis" "select next closest object" "select next closest player" "select next closest anything"
"select next closest mantis and move to" "select next closest object and move to" "select next closest player and move to" "select next closest anything and move to"

Additional binding ideas not currently in game:
"turn at 10* per second (separate right&left bindings)" "Turn to right at 25* per second" "select next squad member" "forward at 1/2 thrust"


In conclusion, if you support key mapping it would give players a lot more control over ships and would allow the game to be adaptable to a wider base of play styles, allowing more people to enjoy Pirate Galaxy. Key remapping alone in my opinion would solve 90+ % of the complaints related to user control and improve game play for the majority of PG players. Please consider making ship control improvements a priority.
 

handsanitizer

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I miss the old flying controls, they should just bring them back but knowing pg, they wont. Before drac came out flying just felt so much simpler, and using relative controls isnt the same. turning was easier, flying with mouse was easier. Just miss the old days^^
 

tuusk

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Razzorkill said:
Two things that might make it easier to steer:
1 use relative ship control.
2 disable ship chaser camera.
This way it's much easier to control the ship :)
Right you are!

Those are options I would not imagine playing PG without.
You could have realized that if you bothered to read my post :p


However I repeat again that even with above options on, your
ship tries to turn toward camera direction in many occasions.
 

ace55

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the wasd controls i never used,i dont like movement of the ship during a battle..so i use the mouse for movement/target and the items of my ship i use the numpad..lot closer the numberkey for each ability of the ship..always happens to me when i change ship i am trying not forget i did change it ,to not push a wrong button lol example storm nr 5 button afterbuner it is and sniper has the sniper blaster..when this happens in the wrong time it is terrible
 

grigorije

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Yeah its a bit tricky, to NOT folow a selected ship don't left click it but RIGHTclick it.

<a href="http://www.pirategalaxy.com" target="_blank"><img style="border:0" src="http://signature.pirategalaxy.com/signature.php?avatar=64113" alt="grigorije" title="grigorije" /></a>

< signature not working oh noes


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tuusk

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. As I wrote, I already learned that you can select target without follow with right-click. Why it took me much time to realize that is because all graphical UI-s I know so far use left-click for making selection and also I have right mouse button held down like 90% of time while I am on planet - to steer camera.

. One of main points in my post was that wasting both mouse buttons on targeting and adding rarely needed function like "follow" on one (main button) is perhaps too big luxury as there are only two buttons guaranteed to exist on every mouse/trackball/pad and there we could use at least one button which DOES NOT TARGET ANYTHING for movement, especially as directional keys are not working adequately.
 
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