Limiting Tech in each system.

[GhostRunner]

The Problem...
I just made it to Mizar and needed cryo. Ok, no problem, Ill go to Prosp and get some cryo there. A couple Sol players were harv hunting. Okay fair enough. I went to Antares, to Lustra and started working on getting cryo. Along comes a Sol ship and wipes out all the Harvs, Barbaians and then headed over and wiped out all the Commanders and Sentinals. Thinking ok.. if I start a ship it will be left alone... I keep hunting. No way, my ships and everything was far game under the excuse of looking for the rare BPs there. This is the thing that I have been running into time and time again with no way to remedy it. The upper level players come down and make it harder for the lower lvls to get cryo and experience just by wiping out everything on a field with a couple shots from their super guns. This is unfair to those that wish to advance in the game and makes it so that those lower level people get discouraged and quit playing the game. I have actually had several clan mates quit due to this.

Now.. my suggestion
Limit how far back Tech and ships can go.. I know its nice to take a Gem blaster and help a mate in vega.. but is it really needed? Antares tech would be sufficient to do just that. And it would give everyone a fair and fighting chance to level up, get much needed cryo and experience. Im suggesting for the Vega, no further forward then Antares. For Antares, Gem and Mizar Tech only. For Mizar, Sol and Draconis.

Some of the upper lvl players will grumble about this, but think back to when you were playing a low lvl and someone came in and stole your kill or just out and out made it so you couldnt get what you needed at that time. It seems like a big thing, but I think it would make it more enjoyable to those players that truly do wish to play this game. If you want to hunt rares, get a ship above the system and hunt. It might take a lil longer but it will give the other players a fighting chance to play the game to.

 

[Emporar]

This is a problem and one that is very annoying, and i have found myself in this position many times. If you ask them to stop doing it, some may just call u a noob and continue, or just ignore you. If you were there first, then the other player has no right to invade your mantis/kills.

As for your suggestion, I don't think it will work as that is just limiting players even more and it would not cause a grumble, it would cause the ground to shake from all the complants.

 

[GhostRunner]

That's just it.. at the moment there are no limits on what the players can do, other then the CQ's.
Thing is, it would be exactly like the limits placed on a CQ. You can't take tech past this point. Simple as that... There has to be a point that someone says enough is enough. Let the ground shake and the wall tremble with their grumbling, for without an infusion of new blood and new paying players, there will be no reason to keep updating this game or even keeping the servers open.
Attitudes like what some of the higher players display are driving off players that would otherwise excel in this game... and quite possibly be paying members to get with memberships or upgrades. I know before I hit Antares, I had seriously considered getting the membership, but on reaching Antares and seeing the attitude there from some of the upper levels... I decided against it for the time being...

 

[HyDroxYl]

I am against this. And you all know why. Its easier to find a rare with a higher level ship. A suggestion would be that of making a new update which puts more harvs on every planet.

 

[lance]

heres something thatl get raged at: how about only being able to use each system ship 1 system lower than the respective systems?

rares (a captain obvious moment i know) are rare. So what is the point in them suddenly being easier to get? they are supposed to be an achievement... not easy to get.

this would also get rid of those pesky noob killers

 

[DeathsBeast]

If you were there first, then the other player has no right to invade your mantis/kills.

Mantis can not be 'owned' as has been said in many threads before, it is with such that you being their first is of no pertinence. Yes, wouldn't we all love a world where we could do exactly what we wanted without any outside interference! Too bad it's not Pirate Galaxy... Other players have every right that you do to shoot the same mantis you're shooting, either move on or deal with it.

A good idea is to farm exp, since you are most likely interested in that anyways (so long as they don't 1-shot it). If it's harvs, wait for the guy to hit it, tag it yourself, go under it and hope you can pick up the loot! Otherwise, you are going to have to think of a MUCH better solution, because I can guarantee this one will never be implemented. Conquests' makes sense, as to that argument, it is system pvp, conquests don't work '1 system above' or anything, so in that comparison you could only allow same system ships and that's absurd. When (or if) you get up in the systems, you'll realize this is absurd.

 

[GhostRunner]

Thing is DeathsBeast.. some people dont want to farm the exp. I couldnt use the exp because of my lvl.. a harv kill is like 1xp.. not worth my time to sit and kill to lvl up. I was looking for the interceptors that come with harv hunting. A one shot kill doesn't allow for any interceptors to far. It was the Inters I was wanting for the cryo. There is no reason to "Hog" all the Harvs or any ship in one area.. If I am hunting I at least share what ships are there..I dont go around blasting all of them and then be rude about it when asked to leave a few for other players.
If the higher lvl players want rare bps.. then same thing back at them.. drop to a lower gun that doesnt one shot one kill, tag the bloody ship themselves and let someone else get the kill.. then they can see if a gold drops. Communicate with the other playes.. dont be snobs and think that you are better then everyone else just because you have sol tech, cause at one point.. you too were only a lvl 5 or 6 and just starting the game.
I have and other people have been ridiculed just because they are lvl 25, or 36 and are trying to get cryo when dealing with some of the Sol players.. there is no reason for this. Yes, its a game. But still.. no reason to be rude and nasty to anyone just because you are a higher level then them. Think of how you would feel if the GMs took over Sol with the new Draconis weapons.. one shot kills while you are trying to get that rare Sol gun, leaving you out of the loop and unable to get the cryo or bps you yourself might be hunting for. I know that every high lvl would be yelling foul about that.. but they dont think about that when doing the same to a lower lvl.

 

[DeathsBeast]

Soooo what you're doing is trying to hurt all of those 'snobs', not make the game better... Go find another place to grind. Not everyone's a snob, but yes, such is life, many not-so-pleasant people. I don't see this helping anything.

 

[peck]

The day this get's implemented is the day splitscreen dose out of business. That many players would just quit.

 

[blackroger]

The day this get's implemented is the day splitscreen dose out of business. That many players would just quit.

I agree, there are enough restrictions in place already

 

[Death-Hunter]

pls remember not all players are like that u sayd in ur first post...... if i needed something at the place u were before i would first ask u what u need and if u need same as me ill leave but if i need harvs and u need barbarians i would leave thm all for u...but that's me i agree there are some .......... players in there :mrorange:

 

[Delloda]

I can predict several hundred threads of moaning and complaining if we implemented any of these. Look at the moaning we got from restricted in ships levels in missions!

 

[Ahsoka]

I'm still against that Delloda but no more Restrictions, if 1 more comes in the Game then i won't play again.

 

[DeathsBeast]

I must retract my opposition to this and now put my full support behind it!

 

[Ahsoka]

I must retract my opposition to this and now put my full support behind it!

i put my full support for ur next "Vacation"

 

[GhostRunner]

DeathsBeast... this suggestion was not intended to hurt anyone.. as, if it went into affect tomorrow, I would be just a limited as anyone else. I never said all the upper levels were snobs.. just the majority that I have seen. With the rare few I have seen, most wouldn't give a dieing man a drink of water.. even though they are carrying a pack with 200 gallons in it. They enter, take over an area and basically tell anyone one that says anything to F. off and go away. Heaven help anyone that has a backbone to actually stand up and say something to them about their attitude.. as they are quickly blacklisted and targeted. As has happened to me a couple times. Targeted as in, having a half dozen sol ships surround you and kill everything, even if you move to a new area... and as far as a new planet. Fair play in the game? Bull. That's just a bunch of bullies pushing their weight around..

Death-Hunter. I do apologize if you feel that I included you in the general grouping. I didn't mean to say that ALL upper lvls acted this way.. just the majority that I have seen. I know there are some that enjoy helping out lower lvls, as was the case with Dark Mantis giving a group of us a major hand getting past the last couple mission in Gemini to get us to Mizar.

HyDroxYl.. Putting more harvs on the planets wouldn't help. On Lustra at the highest lvl harvs, it took one Sol ship less then 45 seconds to destroy the area, turn around and do the same to the Commanders and Sentis and then come back just as they were re-spawning. Putting more harvs on would just make it take a little longer to kill them all.. nothing more. One shot one kill with the Sol ship still takes away the ability of the lower lvl to be able to hunt the harv even though there might be 200 harvs in that one area.

Peck.. how is SS to stay in business if they are unable to bring in new customers? Have a Sol ship sit in vega and kill all the harvs and the new player will not come back. Meaning no new players to pay for the more expensive upgrades. Having a solid base of long term customers is a good thing, but after a while, it no longer pays the bills because costs go up and with the same amount of income coming in, they would have to shut down anyways.

 

[Cooper Kid]

I agree with this, sadly the high ranking players who buzz around whithout a care in the world, podding lower levels and clearing out harvester zones seem to outnumber those who are more considerate. I've been witness to a PvP on more than one occasion between two Sol ships, one trying to stop the other from stealing all the kills.

And as has been said before, I'm not complaining about having kills stolen now and then - no, mantis aren't our property once we've taken one shot at them - but it's incredibly frustrating when there aren't any mantis around because there's one Sol taking all the kills. You'd have thought they'd take a hint and stop respawning!

 

[CommanderCody]

One of the unspoken rules of the forums is... NO MORE RESTRICTIONS!

Also, remeber most folks are in Sol now with nothin to do but hunt and hang around, once Drac comes out things WILL improve (for a time and to an extent atleast)

 

[Beowrath]

People need to remember that this is a game and like all games there are rules, obstacles, conditions, and constraints (i.e., restrictions) that are designed to make the game challenging, stimulating, and enjoyable to play. If you want no restrictions, how about we just start every player at level 99 with an x-shadow sniper, fully equipped with rare BP tech, with PM permanently on and just let everyone go at each other. For most people this would quickly grow old and they would leave to go play more interesting games.

No, eliminating or restricting advanced ships/tech in lower level systems would make this game so much better for everyone, not just the new players. Think about it, players could play PvP at every level, exploring squad vs. squad or squad vs. higher tech (no restrictions on players bringing their lower level ships/tech to any higher level system that they’ve unlocked). The high level players could bring their system appropriate (or lower) ships out to play and no one would have to worry about some noobinator or red=dead jerk ruining their play by podding them all in one shot just because they can. There is no skill involved in podding a player with lower tech than you. In fact there is very little skill involved in any 1v1 PvP in this game. Even with equal level tech the critical hit randomness means that any equal level 1v1 win is mostly luck. No, this is a strategy game, not a skill game. The strategy lies in figuring out what combination of tech and ships will give your squad some advantage over your opponents and then figuring out possible tactical strategies to apply these advantages. I have seen very little evidence of people working on these tactical strategies even in the CQs. Mostly, I’ve seen clans only winning because of an advantage in numbers, not tactics or strategy (yes, I’ll concede that having more numbers can be a successful strategy).

No advanced ships/tech in lower level systems also means that people would actually have to do the missions themselves or with some same level buddies instead of letting advanced ships/tech blast their way clear for them or heal them or the ship they are escorting (yes many people know about the glitch that allows the repair field to work on ghosts). The developers spent a lot of time creating these challenging and stimulating missions but many pilots don’t care, they just want the most advanced ship and tech. So they get their higher level buddies to carry them through the missions and finding them the top and rare BPs quickly. And what for, so they can get to Sol and then complain that they are bored? The forums are full of pilots complaining that they are bored and offering suggestion for new systems, but if they had taken their time and tried to solve the story mission challenges themselves they probably would have enjoyed the game much more and would have spent more time actually playing the game. That does bring up a good possible enhancement to the game, however. Why don’t we let players have the missions available to redo so they could try to complete them by themselves or in a shorter amount of time. There could be a ranking system for the player or squad that finishes a mission in the least amount of time or with the fewest players.

Yes, when the Draconis system opens it will help reduce the problem of the advanced ships/tech in lower systems, but that will last only a short while. During that time you may see fewer newer players leaving the game, but soon the high level players will be done with the new system and back causing problems for players in the lower systems. The developers must attract new players to replace the top level players who leave. Top players leave because they have solved most everything and/or are just bored and want to try something new (and don’t want to wait for the next system to come out). Actually, they need to attract more new players than those who leave because they want the game to grow and the money must come from somewhere. So if this problem of the advanced players ruining the game play for the lower level players is not somehow resolved, it could eventually mean the end of development on the game, unless you want it to become more pay-to-play then it is now. Many players I know have pretty much resolved not to spend any money on this game (some have just stopped playing) until this problem is resolved.

There have been several ideas fielded on how to keep the advanced ship/tech out of the lower level systems such as a straight restriction as GhostRunner has suggested in this forum thread, or by simply reducing the incentive for them to be in the lower level systems by eliminating all drops from mantis that have higher system tech used on them (as I suggested in a previous post: http://forum.pirategalaxy.com/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=8011).

Note that any solution would not affect the story missions that take pilots to lower level systems because there you have the mission-only mantis that the advanced ships/tech could attack and have drop items. Yes, it is much easier for players to grind for BPs with higher level ships, but perhaps if the advanced ships/tech could not get BPs from lower level systems, the developers might be more willing to reduce the drop rates a little. If you look at some of the high level players’ BP lists, you will see that many of them have been very successful in finding the rare BPs. Of course, when you can kill whole fields of mantis in a few seconds with the higher level tech, a low drop rate doesn’t really mean much. The drop rate is really only meaningful to the players with only the system level tech. Remember, the main reason that a player is at a higher level is because they started playing the game earlier or have had more free time to spend on it (or because they have had higher level players carry them through the game). It is not because they are more skilled (see above), although some strategies could lead to slightly faster advancement.

I know that I have run on very long, and I hope that players will take this in the spirit that it was intended, and that is only to find ways to make an already good game better and help insure it will remain available with continued updates for a long time to come.

-Beowrath

 

[blackroger]

People need to remember that this is a game and like all games there are rules, obstacles, conditions, and constraints (i.e., restrictions) that are designed to make the game challenging, stimulating, and enjoyable to play. If you want no restrictions, how about we just start every player at level 99 with an x-shadow sniper, fully equipped with rare BP tech, with PM permanently on and just let everyone go at each other. For most people this would quickly grow old and they would leave to go play more interesting games.

No, eliminating or restricting advanced ships/tech in lower level systems would make this game so much better for everyone, not just the new players. Think about it, players could play PvP at every level, exploring squad vs. squad or squad vs. higher tech (no restrictions on players bringing their lower level ships/tech to any higher level system that they’ve unlocked). The high level players could bring their system appropriate (or lower) ships out to play and no one would have to worry about some noobinator or red=dead jerk ruining their play by podding them all in one shot just because they can. There is no skill involved in podding a player with lower tech than you. In fact there is very little skill involved in any 1v1 PvP in this game. Even with equal level tech the critical hit randomness means that any equal level 1v1 win is mostly luck. No, this is a strategy game, not a skill game. The strategy lies in figuring out what combination of tech and ships will give your squad some advantage over your opponents and then figuring out possible tactical strategies to apply these advantages. I have seen very little evidence of people working on these tactical strategies even in the CQs. Mostly, I’ve seen clans only winning because of an advantage in numbers, not tactics or strategy (yes, I’ll concede that having more numbers can be a successful strategy).

No advanced ships/tech in lower level systems also means that people would actually have to do the missions themselves or with some same level buddies instead of letting advanced ships/tech blast their way clear for them or heal them or the ship they are escorting (yes many people know about the glitch that allows the repair field to work on ghosts). The developers spent a lot of time creating these challenging and stimulating missions but many pilots don’t care, they just want the most advanced ship and tech. So they get their higher level buddies to carry them through the missions and finding them the top and rare BPs quickly. And what for, so they can get to Sol and then complain that they are bored? The forums are full of pilots complaining that they are bored and offering suggestion for new systems, but if they had taken their time and tried to solve the story mission challenges themselves they probably would have enjoyed the game much more and would have spent more time actually playing the game. That does bring up a good possible enhancement to the game, however. Why don’t we let players have the missions available to redo so they could try to complete them by themselves or in a shorter amount of time. There could be a ranking system for the player or squad that finishes a mission in the least amount of time or with the fewest players.

Yes, when the Draconis system opens it will help reduce the problem of the advanced ships/tech in lower systems, but that will last only a short while. During that time you may see fewer newer players leaving the game, but soon the high level players will be done with the new system and back causing problems for players in the lower systems. The developers must attract new players to replace the top level players who leave. Top players leave because they have solved most everything and/or are just bored and want to try something new (and don’t want to wait for the next system to come out). Actually, they need to attract more new players than those who leave because they want the game to grow and the money must come from somewhere. So if this problem of the advanced players ruining the game play for the lower level players is not somehow resolved, it could eventually mean the end of development on the game, unless you want it to become more pay-to-play then it is now. Many players I know have pretty much resolved not to spend any money on this game (some have just stopped playing) until this problem is resolved.

There have been several ideas fielded on how to keep the advanced ship/tech out of the lower level systems such as a straight restriction as GhostRunner has suggested in this forum thread, or by simply reducing the incentive for them to be in the lower level systems by eliminating all drops from mantis that have higher system tech used on them (as I suggested in a previous post: http://forum.pirategalaxy.com/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=8011).

Note that any solution would not affect the story missions that take pilots to lower level systems because there you have the mission-only mantis that the advanced ships/tech could attack and have drop items. Yes, it is much easier for players to grind for BPs with higher level ships, but perhaps if the advanced ships/tech could not get BPs from lower level systems, the developers might be more willing to reduce the drop rates a little. If you look at some of the high level players’ BP lists, you will see that many of them have been very successful in finding the rare BPs. Of course, when you can kill whole fields of mantis in a few seconds with the higher level tech, a low drop rate doesn’t really mean much. The drop rate is really only meaningful to the players with only the system level tech. Remember, the main reason that a player is at a higher level is because they started playing the game earlier or have had more free time to spend on it (or because they have had higher level players carry them through the game). It is not because they are more skilled (see above), although some strategies could lead to slightly faster advancement.

I know that I have run on very long, and I hope that players will take this in the spirit that it was intended, and that is only to find ways to make an already good game better and help insure it will remain available with continued updates for a long time to come.

-Beowrath

I have played this game since the beta, and I am well aware of all the restrictions that have been put in place since the game was created. In its
current form the game is reasonably balanced, and I for one do not want more restrictions .