Code of conduct Issues

[Dakahn]

The current code of conduct's restrictions on pvp is unfair for players.

Almost any battle that one of the combatants didn't agree to can be considered as harassment.

"(a) harass: Covers a wide range of offensive behavior. It is commonly understood as behavior intended to disturb or upset, and it is characteristically repetitive. In the legal sense, it is intentional behavior which is found threatening or disturbing"

Also the restrictions on landing zone pvp are somewhat flawed. In my opinion they should be revised to:
No pilots shall engage in combat until at least 15 seconds have passed since both parties have landed.

This would also by proxy restrict the usage of mines in the landing zone and will give pilots a chance to run to orbit if there are enemies in the landing zone.

Overall there also is a need for the code to be more specific. From griefing (you could translate this to say that anyone stealing harvesters needs a warning), to the language restrictions (some GMs give warnings for words that are considered by most people not to be offensive, while others only say watch your language for curse words and don't even give an official warning.)

In closing, the CoC should be reformed to have almost no restrictions on pvping, and should be more specific, since even players that have read it can still be given warnings ect. from a part of the rules they didn't understand or were twisted due to the vague wording.

This is a pirate game.
Dakahn

 

[134679hun]

If someone dies in a so called 'unfair' pvp and complains about it they should just get muted. if u go red, and die, u asked for it.

 

[SlothSIN]

If someone dies in a so called 'unfair' pvp and complains about it they should just get muted. if u go red, and die, u asked for it.

I'm sorry but this issue is more the high levels that take their drac and go to vega. It happens to all of us don't get me wrong but it doesn't make it right. The concept of pvp is to have players pitty agenst each other, not turn noobs into blaster folder. Do some of them really need to ego boost that bad? Its like an 40 year old man kicking a 10 year old. All it is going to do is drive players away from the game.

(Added now that I have ample amount of time to respond)But as it has been shown before on the fourms its a debate that will never die. I perfectly understand the Red is dead, but there are some people that take it to an extream doing it purely because they can.

The biggest thing I don't agree with though is mainly the LZ camping in vega. But as to harassmnt it would have to hapen multiple times for it to be a harassment. And even then form the legal point they have to clearly say stop. But because you willingly go into PM its a grey issue. The acheivements do not help any in the matter either though. You get an achivement for podding different ships, you get one for doing missions in pm.

The only thing I ever try to get if noob podded is at least a same tech fight. Is it really that much to ask for really?

 

[YeaYeaYea]

there is no reason or excuse for someone in a ship 2 systems or more higher to be podding ships 2 systems or lower ship, 1 system higher is ok in my book, but if you are red on gazica is a sol/meth ship your fair game in my eyes, if your stupid enough to fly around gazica red in a sol ship then you deserve to be podded and if your stupid enough to keep switching red on then you deserved to get podded over and over till you learn your lesson why have a bounty system if we cant use it, the only time you can claim to be harrassed is if someone is sending you nasty pms or if your white and trying to do missions and someone is making the mission harder for you over and over again, but as soon as you go red simple fact is your dead no crying no moaning cos you was the fool that went red in the first place, there is no such thing as red for exp only red is not there for exp boost thats what exp boosters are there for in the gold shop

 

[134679hun]

well, if people want to be known as noob podders thats there choice, and blame the achievements^^ getting pvp achievements is hard because we only get a cq like once every other week, and its vega usualy because all others we win uncontested. so if u want the pvp achievement, sometimes you have to kill a noob when the chance comes, because by time u go change to get a fair tek ship they could have ran to orbit to hide and such.

 

[pbhuh]

The game defends the high players who kill low players in every aspect, this has been an issue for years.

But there was a time in PG where the clanleaders and clans often had rules not do pod someone just because he was in a lower ship as it would be bad advertisement for the clan. I think that was once the only real reason that high players would not pod one, but lone wolves wouldn't care and still kill you.

The game has to protect the low levels against the bounty hunters or against achievement-getters. Not with stupid COC rules that limit it totally, but just debuffs and other types of things that would make it less fun to kill low levels, but possible.

 

[YeaYeaYea]

all mmog out there well 90% of them do not limit tech/equipment/level in pvp and adding more limits to this game will only kill it that bit faster, i think if your a repeat noob killer it should show in some kind of rep counter system that you carry with you through the game this will name and shame the noob killers with lots of bad rep and show just who they are without adding even more limits in the game

 

[pbhuh]

all mmog out there well 90% of them do not limit tech/equipment/level in pvp and adding more limits to this game will only kill it that bit faster, i think if your a repeat noob killer it should show in some kind of rep counter system that you carry with you through the game this will name and shame the noob killers with lots of bad rep and show just who they are without adding even more limits in the game

these kind of systems should demotivate low-rank killers.

 

[Dakahn]

The point of this topic was not for debate over red=dead, this topic was for the gm's and devs to see that there are too many loopholes and such to allow the banning of players for things that are not ban worthy.

In my opinion, noob podding is not acceptable, but there are players and clans that hunt down noob podders and make them pay. There shouldn't be rules in the official code of conduct that restrict something that could be stopped just by players running if they think they are being hunted, or just by not going red.

Dakahn

 

[SlothSIN]

all mmog out there well 90% of them do not limit tech/equipment/level in pvp and adding more limits to this game will only kill it that bit faster, i think if your a repeat noob killer it should show in some kind of rep counter system that you carry with you through the game this will name and shame the noob killers with lots of bad rep and show just who they are without adding even more limits in the game

There was a game I play a few years back that actually penalty for podding those a certian amount under you. What happened was there was a slight boost in attack, a dramatic decrease in deffances (block rating and such) Where ats those that killd off red players or those above them gained a bonus in deffances and luck (lets face it luck would help here lol). That would drive many to pod noob podders, give the noob podders a bonus and weakness. Cap it so there is only so high it can go (or low in some cases) then give the bounty some worth, such as pvp only items. Lets face it there is little to no use for bounty now. it encourages pvp but also encourages people to do something about noob poding. A win win.

This gives those that feels they were wronged a.... justice? The issue still being the same as before but at the same time there being a real reason behind it, and other players willingly doing somehting about it. Lets face it there is always a bigger fish, but higher players can't always be there to fix what they feel isn't right. This way they would have a reason to and everyone is happy.... ish.

 

[Astraeus]

The current code of conduct's restrictions on pvp is unfair for players.

Almost any battle that one of the combatants didn't agree to can be considered as harassment.

"(a) harass: Covers a wide range of offensive behavior. It is commonly understood as behavior intended to disturb or upset, and it is characteristically repetitive. In the legal sense, it is intentional behavior which is found threatening or disturbing"

Also the restrictions on landing zone pvp are somewhat flawed. In my opinion they should be revised to:
No pilots shall engage in combat until at least 15 seconds have passed since both parties have landed.

This would also by proxy restrict the usage of mines in the landing zone and will give pilots a chance to run to orbit if there are enemies in the landing zone.

Overall there also is a need for the code to be more specific. From griefing (you could translate this to say that anyone stealing harvesters needs a warning), to the language restrictions (some GMs give warnings for words that are considered by most people not to be offensive, while others only say watch your language for curse words and don't even give an official warning.)

In closing, the CoC should be reformed to have almost no restrictions on pvping, and should be more specific, since even players that have read it can still be given warnings ect. from a part of the rules they didn't understand or were twisted due to the vague wording.

This is a pirate game.
Dakahn

I will break this apart for Key Answers:

1) Almost any battle that one of the combatants didn't agree to can be considered as harassment - This is True, however a PvP in the actual term of it can easily be done without violation. This was written due to clans “Hunting” other Clans & their members when thet were flying alone & getting “Ganged”

2) restrictions on landing zone pvp / No pilots shall engage in combat until at least 15 seconds have passed since both parties have landed – LZ PvP, Mine Laying, Red(s) Waiting etc was only brought about to promote Fair Game Play for ALL Pilots, Red or White as it is very frustrating to a Pilot who wants to land Red suddenly being “Podded” before he is fully on the Planet & cannot Defend himself

3) griefing goes along with harassment – See #1 above

4) stealing harvesters needs a warning – This is also called “Pillaging” - We have tried this & found it doesn’t work. Taking Cryonite from another is a Part of the game. You can stand & fight it out (PvP) or accept the loss & move on. Is it really worth arguing over? The main thing involved here is the arguments that arise from it which cause dissension among the Community. Many Pilots have used this as a form of Harrassment towards other Pilots in other Clans who are “Enemies”

5) language restrictions – I will be blunt here, certain words the begin with F or S are forbidden in any way shape or form as is Chat Masking (The use of any other Character in the attempt to hide offensive words or meanings), You will be Penalized for using them with either a warning or other Penalty. Other cussing, swearing, offensive name calling etc, is also looked down upon & warnings or other Penalties will be Issued. GMs do give what is called “Hand Slap” warnings when a word is used in a way that makes it offensive to others (Context Warning). GM don’t like to act as “Space Policia” watching for Language Violations. Please watch what you say or how you say it – ask yourself if unsure “Would I say this to my Mother or Father? Would I say it to a Preacher or Priest? Would I say this to the 10 year old kid down the street?
Examples of Chat Masking: ********, @*^!~&#, or replacing 1st letter with another, deliberately mispelling a forbidden word

 

[Dakahn]

1) Almost any battle that one of the combatants didn't agree to can be considered as harassment - This is True, however a PvP in the actual term of it can easily be done without violation. This was written due to clans “Hunting” other Clans & their members when thet were flying alone & getting “Ganged”

Is this saying that it is illegal to hunt down someone who had noob podded a member of your clan? If there is no retribution from clans for things like that, certain things will become even more rampant and more unnecessary CoC rules will be installed.

2) restrictions on landing zone pvp / No pilots shall engage in combat until at least 15 seconds have passed since both parties have landed – LZ PvP, Mine Laying, Red(s) Waiting etc was only brought about to promote Fair Game Play for ALL Pilots, Red or White as it is very frustrating to a Pilot who wants to land Red suddenly being “Podded” before he is fully on the Planet & cannot Defend himself

The reason for my change of the wording for this is to give time to fully get on planet and look around. This would not give penalties to those that wanted a fair pvp on lz, so that mantis can't interfere and so that it is easier to find your pink after the pvp. I have also heard this translated a little differently by one of the gms, he announced it by saying the new rule and that to report it you needed a video, but it didn't matter if you pvped in same system tech on the lz. would you mind clarifying this?

4) stealing harvesters needs a warning – This is also called “Pillaging” - We have tried this & found it doesn’t work. Taking Cryonite from another is a Part of the game.

I wasnt saying that it needed to be an offence, i was pointing out a part of the CoC that was too vaguely worded to allow for some to interpret it that way

5) language restrictions – I will be blunt here, certain words the begin with F or S are forbidden in any way shape or form as is Chat Masking (The use of any other Character in the attempt to hide offensive words or meanings), You will be Penalized for using them with either a warning or other Penalty. Other cussing, swearing, offensive name calling etc, is also looked down upon & warnings or other Penalties will be Issued.

Once again, i was misunderstood, I agree that curse words shouldn't be allowed, but getting a warning for saying "that was retarded" after getting noob podded doen't deserve a warning.


Once again, the point of this topic was to show that there are getting to be too many regulations on pvp, and that the wording, which is the major issue of the CoC, is too vague.

 

[SlothSIN]

Examples of Chat Masking: ********, @*^!~&#, or replacing 1st letter with another, deliberately mispelling a forbidden word

Does that include things such as "Battle Star Galactica"'s most renound word Fracking? which was clearly created to get around different FCC regulations for nearly any cursing. I have used it beore around GMs and they didn't seem to say anything. But to be frank I think the were too busy laughing at the fact someone actually used the term.

 

[Whatever]

4) stealing harvesters needs a warning – This is also called “Pillaging” - We have tried this & found it doesn’t work. Taking Cryonite from another is a Part of the game. You can stand & fight it out (PvP) or accept the loss & move on. Is it really worth arguing over? The main thing involved here is the arguments that arise from it which cause dissension among the Community. Many Pilots have used this as a form of Harrassment towards other Pilots in other Clans who are “Enemies”

then you can maybe shed some light on this one especially and to relay these facts to SS dev team - WHY do we, the players face these issues:

1)Poor drop in Draconis (Gazica or Hive) - hence the grinding on these planets is pointless

2)For decent grinding we need to use SOL ship on Mars to avoid too big cryo penalty and balance drop, but that obviously doesnt stop people to come with Drac ships and single shot harvs, and/or to steal someone's effort when they shoot harvs in sol ship and have many inters on them while other person just shots harv at the end of it's HP and steals cryo because drac collectors are faster. So this is not a part of game, this is exploitation of someone else's effort.

I'd never come to lower systems (Drac or Sol) if I had the chance to earn cryonite in Sirius. But the SS is NOT helping to keep player's satisfied. More and more players come to higher systems and Mars/Earth (the only places for some sane grinding) are getting too crowded. White missions are waste of time now - cryo reward on them is a joke.

3) Cryo drop in Sirius is ridiculously low compared to strength of mantis over there and effort needed to shoot one. SS should either increase cryo drop so when 2-3 people (minimal sq for positive cryo gain) hunt mantis in Sirius can actually get some cryonite or reduce HP of mantis in Sirius so we can earn something on our own i.e. thorough solo gameplay. And not only cryo drop is bad in Sirius but also Giza rewards - 3bps for single boss that takes 3hrs to respawn and other 3hrs to get intel to fill up event bar - COME ON. it's ok when there are those drones but when you have to shoot normal mantis it's a drag process. Either they should make ancient tech as 1piece BP or remove that intel nonsense because many people cannot get stuff there during the lifetime of a planet.